The ‘already opened thread’ really has little to do with the topic.
Okay, my thoughts on Bootstrap versus Foundation:
[size=“3”]If we want Yii applications to look like a lot of other web applications, then the team could play it safe and go for the ‘most popular’ framework: Bootstrap.
Or the Yii team could go for something different, like Foundation, which again makes it possible to give Yii applications that little extra touch of Yii-ness.
[size="2"]Speaking of popularity: Foundation comes as a Ruby gem (sass module) - and Sass/Compass is definitely more popular (and powerful) than Less. Because that has become the default CSS framework for RoR.
Nothing wrong with Less, but it’s not as widely used (yet) as Sass/Compass - for good reasons.
And you can get a stand-alone tool for Sass/Compass too, if you prefer not to install Ruby and/or use the command line.
I won’t beat this dead horse again - that was my final cents.
It’s the same topic of conversation, the author of the 2nd message (phpnode) realized this too. This thead should be merged to the other thread.
However, as I’ve already explained in the already opened thread, Bootstrap 2 isn’t less customizable than Foundation and it has some advantages over Foundation (which is also good though).
There are a number of HTML5-CSS3 frameworks out there aside from Foundation and Bootstrap, some of which offer dedicated or optional support for jquery, SASS, LESS and other Javascript frameworks.
I think Yii2 needs a CSS framework that is fairly complete so that all demos and tutorials can focus on the glue between the backend and frontend where Yii really shines. So +1 for Twitter’s Bootstrap. It’s mature and feature rich and will serve it’s purpose.
I tried both Foundation 2 and Bootstrap (v1 and v2). Bootstrap has a lot more to offer and it feels more mature than Foundation although I think the fluid grid system of Foundation is way better (and I personally consider responsive layouts to be a really important feature). But with 26000 followers on Github I assume that more people are using (and therefore also testing) Bootstrap than Foundation (3500) which tends to lead to a more robust code base. Anyways, Foundation 3 is coming out in a few weeks and it will be much more focused on better design, so let’s see what they come up with.
btw.: Someone came up with the argument that using Bootstrap will lead to a lot of sites looking the same. Seriously, that can’t be an argument against a CSS framework If people are too lazy to add their own CSS all Yii sites would look the same anyway, regardless of the framework behind.
I’ve also now used foundation2 and bootstrap2 and as much as it pains me to say it, I agree, bootstrap is now a better candidate for the default theme. It really does offer a lot of useful features that are missing in foundation, especially things like dropdown menus, forms etc. I find foundation slightly easier to work with and I agree, the responsive grid is a lot nicer, but at the moment it’s seriously lacking compared to bootstrap2. I think the only really useful thing that came out of that flamewar was that what ever the default is, it should be optional.
No real chat has gone on about how this would be implemented and whether an adapter interface can/will be used. I agree with the optional side however.
@jacmoe - The real, overwhelming factor is going to be themes. I think over the next few years we’re going to see a huge rise in the number of bootstrap themes. Bootstrap themes will become as popular and as common as wordpress themes, if not more so because they’re cross platform. This is going to be bootstrap’s main advantage. Unless some more big companies get behind foundation, it will never gain the momentum and mindshare of bootstrap. There will never be an eco system around foundation. It’s a dead horse in the race at this point, even if it’s technically superior in some ways. Yii2.0 should use the “industry standard”, jQuery is the industry standard javascript lib, bootstrap is now the industry standard css framework, like it or not.
One consistent toolkit (Bootstrap) VS Many heterogeneous components (Foundation + 3rd party components).
Moreover, if the problem is the grid (which is pretty good in my opinion), it’s easier to use Bootstrap (which is very modular) with a different grid, than using Foundation + many 3rd party components to fill the Foundation lack of components.
It is indeed ridiculous to say that Twitter Bootstrap is the Industry Standard CSS Framework.
Not only ridiculous, but bollocks too.
It would be equivalent to saying that Git is the Industry Standard Versioning System, or that Ruby On Rails is the Industry Standard Web Development Platform.
Twitter Bootstrap is Okay, I guess…
What is industry standard is CSS2, CSS3, HTML5 - and so on.
If you want standard, why the heck is Twitter Bootstrap using LESS
When Sass/Compass is more widely used?
It’s the default CSS framework for RoR.
That is an equally ridiculous statement, this time made by me.
I am not saying that you are ridiculous however.
It’s just this whole debacle about Bootstrap from Twitter…
It’s getting really religious.
It’s like listening to Git fanatics or RoR zealots.
